i must confess: i'm in love with my own sins.

[semisweet]

01. on my way home from starbucks/the store just now, i was driving on a little street near my house and i hit a red light. however, by the time i was actually sitting at the intersection, the sun was shining brightly RIGHT next to the light, and no matter how i tried to shade my eyes and hold up a hand, i seriously couldn't tell if the light was red or green. and there's not enough traffic to be all "oh, the cars coming that way are stopped", and it's a one-way street so i couldn't just wait for people coming toward me to go. so i just waited until i figured it was probably green, took a deep breath, and went for it. NOT FUN. D:

02. is kyle peek a father?!?! O.O

03. i have some thinky thoughts about, of all things, seinfeld. well, not so much the show itself, but like...okay. scott loves seinfeld. he thinks it's hilarious, and i realize he is not alone there. i don't necessarily find it un-funny, i guess. i mean, i usually see the jokes coming a mile away, but there are funny moments, and i get a kick out of the concept that it's a show about nothing, and their treatment of the minutiae of daily life can sometimes be quite clever.

however, i've never been able to really enjoy the show, because i find all the characters to be kind of douchebaggy. like, they're all eccentric and whatever, and that's fine, but they're all so inherently selfish and self-involved that it bothers me. and, i mean, i have a long history of loving the "bad" characters on tv shows, from logan echolls to alex karev to chuck bass (with plenty of other stops in-between) but they almost always have an underlying humanity that i think the seinfeld cast does not.

scott thinks i'm ridiculous, and that you don't have to be able to empathize with characters in order to enjoy a show, but i disagree, i think because i rarely watch (or read) things for the plot. 9 times out of 10, i watch the shows i watch for the characters, and i read the books i read for the prose. not to say i don't appreciate a good plot twist or a cliffhanger or just a well-crafted story, but that's rarely my main concern.

now, i know comedy is a different beast than stuff like gossip girl or whatever the hell else i watch, but i think most comedies have characters that are, well, likable, and with whom people can identify, whether it's jim halpert or liz lemon or ted mosby or whatever. scrubs was on the the other day, and scott said he thinks the characters on seinfeld are more likable than the characters on seinfeld. which, i disagree, but i can vaguely understand why he might say that. i mean, JD is not necessarily a great guy. he can be mean, and selfish, and generally kind of weak. but again, there's humanity there, i think. and dr. cox, for all his rage and bluster, has a good heart underneath. (mind you, i haven't actually watched scrubs in a couple of years, so i'm basing this off the first 3 or 4 seasons.)

all of that ^^^ to say, i suppose: what makes a character someone you can relate to/empathize with/enjoy? do you need characters like that to enjoy a TV show? do you agree with me that the characters on seinfeld are unlikable assholes, or have i got it all wrong?

04. david fucking cook having a gigglefit! everyone who cares probably saw this already but you can watch it again. ♥

ETA 05. also, this.

XD *icons*

Comments

[sparkysgirl.livejournal.com]

I saw those pics on his myspace earlier. I have to admit, my interest is piqued. lol.

[inlipstickred.livejournal.com]

right?!?! i saw a couple of them last night (one with the kid and one with the girl) and i was like "um. what?"

O.o

[sparkysgirl.livejournal.com]

But I've seen pics of him with other kids too so I just assumed maybe they were nieces/nephews/whatever.

But OMG....Peek a dad? Can we contain the squee?! *flailing*


And for the record, I agree with you about Seinfeld. I used to watch it all the time years ago. Then three or four years ago I got one of the season DVD sets and watched a bit of it and thought 'whatthehell?' But I have to admit, George's parents are hysterically funny.

[jonas.livejournal.com]

Jerry Seinfeld is the worst television character ever created.

[inlipstickred.livejournal.com]

false. that is marissa cooper.

jerry does, however, pretty much suck.

[15north.livejournal.com]

I think Seinfeld is one of those shows that you have to like in that time period or just like that kind of comedy. I do enjoy it from time to time, but I've never really thought too much about the characters since there are so many episodes to take into account. With anything, there are going to be episodes that feature emotions for one character better than the others. I do kind of think that Jerry is a douche, but everyone else I've never really thought about.

I don't necessarily think that a character has to have a lot of sides (emotionally) to like them. I like the evil characters almost all the time and I'll admit that I probably try to make them seem more sympathetic than they are, but I don't think it's necessary for them to have those emotions to be entertaining. I think the possibility should be there, but, yeah, comedy is different, especially an actual sitcom.

Does this comment make sense? I've been studying for the past three hours and I really shouldn't be on so I typed it fast.

[affectingly.livejournal.com]

The stuff I really enjoy is almost all character driven. I think that's why I eventually got fed up with Lost because I didn't connect enough with the characters and the plot just started to piss me off.

As far as Seinfeld goes, yeah.. they are bad people. I mean, at the end of the whole show they go to jail because they're bad human beings without the decency to step in when someone's being mugged. But as that's sort of the point of the show, I think you have to go in knowing these people are assholes and enjoy it because of that.

My favorite things about characters are ones that are smart and sharp and they don't pussy foot around. They're strong but they still have a vulnerable side and they're incredibly loyal to their friends. Even with characters like Chuck - he is insanely loyal to the people he deems worthy.

[beautifulcity.livejournal.com]

I'm not a huge Seinfeld fan personally, but we had a discussion about this in my TV writing class a few years ago. Those characters are purposely written to be the most selfish, self centered characters with close to redeeming qualities. They brush off everything and don't care about anyone, and even in the end where they are in jail (convicted because of character witness testimonies saying just HOW horrible they are), all they can do is bicker and bitch about the little, stupid details of being in prison. Nothing ever affects them in the manner its supposed to. They don't understand and can't comprehend the major things in life.

I don't know...its not an excuse or a reason to suddenly LOVE the character because they're SUPPOSED to be so unlikable, but just random things I remembered my professor talking about...

[jkpolk.livejournal.com]

I have a very hard time enjoying things without sympathetic characters. And I've had a similar inability to connect with Seinfeld because of it.

I need to like at least one of the characters, at least half the time, or I just can't enjoy something. Other people clearly aren't this way. Which is why I find myself feeling like such a lowbrow twit when I can't get into the deep artsy stuff that some folks cream over.

[morethan-hope.livejournal.com]

SAY WHAT KYLE PEEK?

[hearthisvoice.livejournal.com]

I don't really know Kyle but that kid looks exactly like him.

[tellcincinnati.livejournal.com]

Nephew, maybe? Um, yeah. O.o

[misskatieleigh.livejournal.com]

1) Eeep!
2) that kid is effing adorable
2a) why does that make him like 19490548659869 times more attractive to me? some sort of cultural induced virility thing I imagine.....
3) seinfeld is just meh for me.
4) David Cook laughing will never get old. NEVER.
5) neeeeeeal ♥ who I will totally fight you for

[consumedbywords.livejournal.com]

That Kyle Peek is quite the enigma.

[starwishful.livejournal.com]

This is a very interesting entry! I love Seinfeld, but I think I love it because I loved it when it was originally on. When Seinfeld originally aired, I was a lot younger and watched TV simply for entertainment. I think it's smart and, at the time, was different. Years later, in my mid twenties, I started watching TV for different reasons, more similar to the reasons I read. Now I need to be able to care about the characters and care about the overall story. I need to feel involved and devoted. I need to daydream storylines while in the shower! So, if Seinfeld was introduced today, I bet I'd be like "Whaaaaa?" It's why I can't connect to My Name is Earl, probably. But because I loved it then, I can still enjoy it now... the same way I can still watch old Nickelodeon shows with bad acting and Canadian accents because I loved them dearly when I was 11. Oh, and even though she's just as selfish as the rest of them, for some reason I've always adored Elaine, even though even when originally watching Seinfeld, the other three drove me crazy.

In conclusion, George Costanza is not equal to Logan Echolls but is perhaps equal to Dick Casablancas. :-P

[http://users.livejournal.com/_kittenheels/]

1. Ahhh! Scary!

2. I think so... the kid is adorable! ♥

4. I'm perfectly content with watching that again. XD

5. LOL wot. XD

[themightybee.livejournal.com]

My dad hated Seinfeld for the same reason. That show was NOT allowed on our tv, lol.

I've never really thought about why I enjoy certain shows. The only thing they all have in common is hot hot men. As far as I'm concerned, there is no better reason.

[http://users.livejournal.com/_workinprogress/]

okay, let me preface this by saying I'm a really bad judge of anything to do with kids, but I'm not really sure it's the same kid?
The kid in either picture does look a lot like him, however.
Which still isn't saying much. My older niece bears an uncanncy resemblance to my younger self. A lot more than to my sister. (And somehow that even extends to behavior. I recognize a lot of her mannerisms/poses from pictures of myself and the few memories I have of that time).

Still: *takes a moment to imagine*
... *dies of teh cute*

omg, does that mean that now there'll be baby/kid fic all over the place? /o\


Seinfeld.. I only ever watched when nothing else was on. I never thought it was all that funny, but I guess, it's kind of a thing you need to catch at the right time. (Like, in the 90s with all the hype it was awesome. And it fit better into everybody's life or whatever).
But as far as characters and my enjoyment of a show goes...
I can watch a show where I don't relate to the characters. I can even enjoy that.
I can adore and love a character that has no redeeming quality what-so-ever, but that usually hinges upon the show recognizing that part.
But to really get into it, and not just be a passive watcher, yeah, I do need characters or a world I can relate to.
Good entertainment, for me, is more than just consumption.
If I can be engaged in some way, that's the stuff I watch over and over again.

[maroonjessy5.livejournal.com]

i feel exactly the same way about seinfeld. ughhh, hate hate hate that show. :/

[leila82.livejournal.com]

I feel the same as you re: Seinfeld. There was too much narcissism on the show for me to really enjoy it as a comedy. Maybe it's more realistic that way, idk. But it's not as enjoyable, for sure.

[citibyrd.livejournal.com]

Huh, that's interesting. I'm usually very character oriented and don't much like stories where I can't connect to any of the characters, but I love Seinfeld. I don't think they're good people or have much humanity in them, but that's kind of the point of the show. I think maybe I have different rules for comedy than most other things. If a joke is smart and funny or the delivery is really good, I'll tend to like it even if I don't care about the characters.

[alittlepunchy.livejournal.com]

I'm totally with you on the TV shows thing. Weeds is a good example of this for me. I thought it was a good show, everyone around me thinks its a good show, but I could never maintain enough interest in it to keep me going because I could never relate/empathize/get into the characters on it. And I think that's why I can get so emotionally attached to TV shows, because I honestly care for the "people" in it.

ETA: My Firefox went wonky and posted my comment before I finished. Boo. Anyway - I've never watched Seinfeld, but I'm guessing I wouldn't like it. I love The Office and when one of my co-workers had me watch the British one, I thought it was funny, I enjoyed it, but I didn't feel like I could connect with any of the characters, so I'll probably never own the DVDs or re-watch the series.

[bentalnicole.livejournal.com]

1. oh no, bb! D: i'm glad you made it through safely!
2. i saw those last night, and the kid really, really looks like him. interesting.
3. i hate seinfield. i can't even make it 5 minutes into an episode, before i'm like 'urgh. stfu!' and i change it. i never really thought about why i like the shows i like, but i'm with you on being more drawn to the characters than anything else.
4. ♥ he is too much. i love his giggle face. :D
5. neeeeeal! ♥

[vintagevixen.livejournal.com]

And here I thought I was the only one who isn't too fond of Seinfeld.
I saw those pictures on Kyle's MySpace too. Does The Kid really have a kid? I'm very curious to know.

[sayingwhatiam.livejournal.com]

I HATE SEINFELD SO MUCH. Seriously, there are not words to express my hatred. My dad likes it, so I've had to suffer through a few episodes, and I just want to stab myself.

I've heard all the "oh, it's SUPPOSED to be about nothing" and "they're SUPPOSED to be horrible people" arguments, but it doesn't make the show any less awful. I don't want to watch a show about nothing or about characters being shitty douchebags. Like you, I watch shows for the awesome characters and the plot and OH HEY THAT SHOW HAS NEITHER. It's possible to make characters sucky people and still make them sympathetic, even on a sitcom - Barney on HIMYM is not a great guy, everyone on Friends was kind of intensely selfish, but everyone loves those people. Does anyone love fucking...George or whatever his name is? NO. BECAUSE HE IS STUPID AND AWFUL.

...I have intense, irrational anger about Seinfeld. *cough*

[fluffers.livejournal.com]

Barney on HIMYM is not a great guy, everyone on Friends was kind of intensely selfish, but everyone loves those people. Does anyone love fucking...George or whatever his name is? NO. BECAUSE HE IS STUPID AND AWFUL.
This!

[spifftronica.livejournal.com]

You would probably hate 'It's Always Sunny in Philadelphia' then. The characters are written without a shred of morality to them, each and every one is selfish, boorish, and an indecent human being. I guess a lot of people compare Sunny to 'Seinfeld' and maybe you've pointed out why (I've never watched 'Seinfeld' so I have no idea).

[xsethsownstarx.livejournal.com]

That's totally weird if he has a baby. IDK why, but it just is...

I have never gotten the appeal of Seinfeld.

That gigglefit! Why so adorable bb?

And Neeeeaaaaaaallllll! *gigglesnort*

[skyfalling.livejournal.com]

I need to be emotionally invested to truly enjoy my media, and usually that emotional investment comes from characters I love, though it can also come from clever plotting. As far as characters I love... well, like a lot of people, my favourites tend to be the ultimately flawed characters with strong redeeming qualities or the potential for redemption. (If you've ever read A Song of Ice and Fire, Jaime Lannister is a perfect example of that type for me. He is my faaaaaavourite of favourites!) I would say that I need "deep," well-developed characters, but that's a little vague, innit? Heh. Charm also helps, but that's about as vague a quality as depth, and probably more subjective.

IDK I shouldn't be participating in discussions right now I am so tiiiired.

[snarkyrainbow.livejournal.com]

I have an intersection like that on my way to work. EEP.

And I hate Seinfeld. Lots of people were all like, YOU'LL LOVE IT LOL IT'S LIKE YOU!

And I watched it and thought, so all my friends think I'm a cereal eating douchebag. Nice.

[fluffers.livejournal.com]

I could never, ever get into Seinfeld. I don't know what it is. I even like other shows where there are irredeemable asshats, and characters designed to be hated. IDK, maybe it just always seemed like all they ever did was whine. Which...why would I want to watch that? That's the real world, dude. :/

[faith21.livejournal.com]

I am with you for the most part. Logan and Alex and Chuck and Blair are some of my favorite characters. And the Seinfeld people are horrible, I'd never be able to be friends with them in real life. But I loved that show and I think the beauty of it was that they were so unapologetically assholes (did you see the finale? it wasn't great but it highlights this in a major way)
They say and do the things you secretly want to but shouldn't. My main love for the show comes out of everything being a Seinfeld episode. I mean, they made an entire ep out of being lost in a mall garage in Jersey. *g*

[xrogue81.livejournal.com]

i fucking hate seinfeld.

[xrogue81.livejournal.com]

LOL, yay me and my one-sentence answer. Let me explain why I hate Seinfeld...

In college, my best friend and my roommates loved Seinfeld. They watched reruns all the time. I tried watching it with them but I just didn't think the show was funny at all. Jerry got on my nerves. His voice alone annoys me. I kept wondering why my friends thought the show was hilarious and I felt sort of left out cuz I really thought it sucked.

The one thing I liked about the show is this line in one of the episodes, "Maybe the dingos ate your babies..." but I think it's mostly because it was referenced on Buffy.

I'm very character-driven too, even though the storyline is totally important as well. I used to love LOST cuz the storylines are awesome, but after a while I started hating the main characters and I just stopped watching altogether. I quit Grey's Anatomy for the same reason.

And the shows that I love -- Veronica Mars, Firefly, etc... I'm absolutely in love with the cast. Prettiness counts as well. The Office cast, pretty. The FRIENDS cast, pretty. How I Met Your Mother, pretty. 30 Rock, pretty. Scrubs, pretty. But Seinfeld... NOT PRETTY.

[barrelofthegun.livejournal.com]

I am a huge Seinfeld fan, not necessarily because of the characters, but because of the story lines. I can usually always relate something back to an episode. I just think that they talked about a lot of things that weren't on TV at the time. Sure they are all kind of selfish assholes, but we all can be at times.